Subguns

Bill Blowers

Sausage Six Actual
VIP
Started out with an MP5 and I teach an instrucotr course for Carbines and Subguns. I know some agencies still have them, but does anybody still use one? I haven't seen one in class in a few years and they seem to have finally died in my region. By use, I mean carry it on missions all the time not just shoot it on a range day.
 

ptrlcop

Established
We have two guys on our team that are assigned UMPs. They have an unreasonable attachment to them IMO. They are not used in any special situation or role, just two dudes with different guns than everyone else... One dude really seems to think the folding stock is a great thing for some reason.
 

Detmongo

Amateur
they are still used in my Agency on a daily basis. ESU(swat in most places) is the unit that gets the most use out of them these days.
 
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Bill Blowers

Sausage Six Actual
VIP
One of my buddies does a comedy routine, imagine "Redd Foxx, Elite SWAT Commando". I stole submarine gun from him. Funnier than shit.
 

Default.mp3

Established
Given that the SMG seems to have been replaced by SBRs, what is driving the development of the new SMGs? In particular, I am intrigued by the Sig MPX, but there is also the CZ Evo 3 and the LWRC SMG-45.
 

Default.mp3

Established
Why? Performance still is lacking compared to 5.56.
For me, personally? It'd be primarily for fun, since I don't shoot for a living (I'm looking for excuses to get a pistol can). While an MPX would just be a toy to me, it's nice to know that one's toy isn't totally useless, hence why I'm curious as to whether there have been any changes in thinking in regards to SBRs vs. SMGs, or if the new products are merely relying on CDI/outdated thinking to move units.
 

SPQR476

MAGPUL
Vendor
I still try to justify them. I can still fit an MP5k PDW clone in a messenger bag, and I can't do that even with a folded AR. Not that I've actually done that more than a handful of times, but anyone who grew up in the 80's has to find a way to be able to justify a few MPers around the house. :)
 

EKinOR

Amateur
Vendor
I confess, I do love the MP5. One area where I see a sub gun still possibly having relevance is as a suppressed platform. The 9mm is significantly more quiet than a 5.56mm round, unless you go subsonic. And if we are comparing subsonic rounds, in 9mm I get 147gr or 158gr bullets vs 100gr or less in the 5.56mm. Oh, and just say no to the MP5SD - go with an external can. The ported barrel on the SD cuts the muzzle velocity too much.
 

jnc36rcpd

Regular Member
There were a few Baltimore/Washington area agencies that issued semiautomatic MP-5's in lieu of the shotgun. As I recall, two were transit police forces. I did see an Ocean City Police officer with his assigned semiautomatic at an IALEFI RTC a couple of years ago. A few years prior, he would have been the coolest kid in class. As it was, he was jealous of the AR-15's the rest of us had.

We also had the semiautomatic Colt AR-15 back in the day. Given the limited training and support for that platform, I preferred the shotgun. I was somewhat perturbed that, during the Beltway sniper case. I ended up with the Colt because I was one of the few qualified with both weapons. If you have ever read the book "Sniper", there is a photograph of my patrol car on a high-risk stop of one of the "white box trucks" we stopped. I had just been directed to trade my slide gun for a big 9mm pistol. I am clearing the cab, jut out of the photograph. I still recall thinking that if the suspect suddenly popped up, I would much prefer to have my 870 in hand. Ah, good times!
 
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