Balor Aimpoint Micro on Glock 19: Starting a journey

[controlledpairs2]

I just picked up a Raven Concealment Balor and aimpoint H1 to mount onto my Glock 19. I'll post pics when installation is complete (guessing it'll take me 5 min). I'll keep you all updated on my progress and learning. Let the journey begin.

Any feedback or advice or wisdom from the enterprise?

-Alex

 

[controlledpairs2]

This is one way to take a $500 Glock 19 and turn it into a $1800 experiment.

 

[controlledpairs2]

Took me a couple hours gently working a heat gun to get it to fit in a 6354DO

 

[Cheeseman]

Does the ALS still function on that holster? I recently put a Balor/H1 combo on a 17.

 

[controlledpairs2]

Yes the ALS is still functional. I didn't have to modify the actual ALS mechanism at all. The polymer hood and wings were far too tight and I need to heat and bend and expand the hood area to accept enough of the H1 for the als to "catch"

I had to remove the plastic piece that covers the flashlight lens. X300u bezel was too long. I've never had a flashlight ND in my holster so I'm comfortable not having that.

 

[controlledpairs2]

First outing of the Balor setup. Positives are that: 1) I could find the dot easily and as naturally as my irons, 2) tracking the dot was easy

Negatives: 1) I was getting a stovepipe 30% of the time, 2) failure to feed/ feedway stoppage (round was wedged between the feedramp and top of chamber and slide) 30% of the time, 3) the gun isn't shooting as flat as I expected.

I was shooting 124gr blazer brass factory. I understand that the Comp needs hotter rounds to be more effective but w/ 124gr it didn't seem worth the cost.

Has anyone been in my shoes? Thanks.

 

[PatMcG]

I know some guys run lighter recoil springs and they have milled rmr which adds zero weight. You've added weight the the slide. Probably need lighter spring


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[Cheeseman]

My 17 balor combo has run flawlessly. I've run an absolute garbage mix of ammo through it with no issues. Some steel cased ball, brass cased ball and HP's of all variety and some federal duty rounds (unsure of exact rounds since I pulled them out of some old MP5 mags). I did this to check reliability.

Is it possible that the tighter tolerances of the KKM barrel had something to do with your malf's or is it more likely that the comp caused them?

 

[controlledpairs2]

I should have researched what the extra weight of the H1 & Balor mount would have done, in addition to the KKM Comp. I've added too many variables all at once so I cannot say for certain what the fix should be. Before I go ordering lighter recoil springs and striker springs, I'm going to test the pistol once more. I only brought the 124gr w/ me last trip, but I'll try 115gr and my duty ammo.

Last trip I used 5 magpul Glock Pmags that have been flawless in my 17s. I can't shake the feeling that they played some role. I'll be using factory 19 mags only next range trip.

If things don't go well, I will be trying the 15lb and 13lb recoil spring assemblies. Thanks for the help PATMcG and Cheeseman.

 

[controlledpairs2]

The gun ran 100% using Speer 115 and 124 gr duty ammunition. It was police discard, late 90's gold dot. The extra +p really helped get the slide moving and the gun felt flat under recoil. Can track the dot throughout recoil.

I see the dot right away but to make a Down Zero at 7 yards I'm 1.5sec out of a safariland 6354do. The extra length of the comp adds some time, as does the ALS retention. With a glock 19 out of a Raven phantom I'm usually, and easily under 1sec.

Running an el prez @ 7yds, I'm usually at 7.5 to guarantee a clean run. I see similar times with the balor. I tried an el prez at 15yds and I was almost 1.5 seconds faster to guarantee a clean run.

What I am learning with the dot is that I can call my shots with confidence, where I would be less consistent in calling my shots w my irons.

Still waiting on the lower power recoil springs so that I can shoot my 115 blazer.

 

[WhoaCowboy!]

The KKM barrels have tighter tolerances and a greater degree of chamber case support. The Glock factory barrels obviously are set up for maximum reliability. I have three KKM barrels. The first is for a Glock 23 installed circa 2004. No feed problems with any ammo and thousands of 40S&W lead reloads over the years. I ordered a KKM 9mm this summer for a new Gen 4 G19. This particular KKM barrel had feed issues with both brass and aluminum FMJs. My son was with me and his identical Gen 4 with factory barrel ate everything flawlessly. I called KKM and they reworked or sent me a new barrel that runs fine. I recently ordered a KKM 9mm comped for my own RS project. This barrel will sometimes have issues with the Federal aluminum cases. It runs flawlessly with Speer Lawman 147 TMJ, Speer 147 GD 2 and my carry Federal HST 147s. It also eats Federal 115 JHP XM , 9BPLE +P+ , old Corbon 115 +P+ etc and assorted other ammo 115 and 124 fmjs. . I totally agree with Dr GKR that one should decide on a carry round, find a top of line TMJ to duplicate its ballistics like Speer or American Eagle and put hundreds of rounds through it especially if using a close tolerance aftermarket barrel like the KKM..unfortunately last year I had a dealer put a Storm Lake 9mm barrel along with other goodies in a new Generation 4 G19. This was prior to my getting up to speed on P&S. The barrel was totally unreliable and it is in my scrap heap.

I have never had to change the weight of the recoil springs.

At distance, say 50 yards/25 yards , the KKM comped (with RDS) allows me accurate hits that are impossible with the factory G19 barrel ( and RDS). The uncomped KKM is on the G19 with iron sights and groups much tighter than the factory but I cannot hit at 50 with my older eyes/arms.

 

[controlledpairs2]

Thanks for sharing your experiences.

 

[simojo]

I'm going down the Roland route with a Baylor T1 mount and KKM barrel with comp. Gen4 G19 and only other mods are Vickers mag release, Freya magwell, and trigger polish.

I went to zero it yesterday running Winchester white box 115g and it would stove pipe about every one. I tried my Speer Gold dot 124g+P which is my carry ammo and it was better but the pistol still wasn't going back into battery fully.

Suggestions? I get that it may never run the WWB 115, but thought the 124+P would run.

I shot the pistol with the KKM and comp only prior to getting the Baylor and it ran the 115g fine.

Side note question: I polished the trigger parts with a dremel and buffing bit dipped in Mother's polish and don't feel I overdid it. When I dryfire and reset the slide while holding the trigger, the slide will bump forward about a 1/16" while I release the trigger and seat into battery. Is that normal? I don't remember it being like that before.

 

[controlledpairs2]

That's really interesting. It seems that the extra weight of the balor and micro makes the 115gr less reliable. I am surprised that the weight of the micro and balor can change the slide dynamics when it's only about 2.5oz more in weight.

Are all the springs factory stock?

 

[simojo]

That's really interesting. It seems that the extra weight of the balor and micro makes the 115gr less reliable. I am surprised that the weight of the micro and balor can change the slide dynamics when it's only about 2.5oz more in weight.

Are all the springs factory stock?

Yes, all stock.

 

[chrischris]

Check the spring that sits in your striker block. If it's misaligned it can cause issues with your slide not moving completely forward during trigger reset.

 

[simojo]

Check the spring that sits in your striker block. If it's misaligned it can cause issues with your slide not moving completely forward during trigger reset.

Bingo! Thanks chrischris!! I stripped down the slide and when I pulled the firing pin safety, the spring appeared to be laying in the hole sideways. I reassembled without the safety or spring and the trigger reset fine. Once completely reassembled, everything worked fine upon function test.

I then went to the range to check function and the 115g WWB functioned better but still had some stove pipes and misfeeds. The Speer GD 124g+P functioned well, but there was still one misfeed in the 75 rounds I fired.

I zeroed at 25 yds and the 124g+P was still hitting roughly POA/POI at 100 yds. It was around zero degrees here today, so I didn't spend that much time on the 100yd steel!

Also on an interesting note, at 3yds doing Dot Torture I had to account for mechanical offset which isn't something I've seen discussed with the pistol RDS. I'm sure it's more pronounced in the Balor/T1 setup than in a milled RMR slide. (And not that 1" at 3yds really matters...) I stepped the target back to 7yds and it was close to POA/POI, as much as my frozen hands could tell.

I'll post something on the FB Primary group and see if there's any more response on the lower weight recoil springs.

 

[K Williams]

A few topics down, with info from the FB threads:

https://primaryandsecondary.com/forum/index.php?threads/recoil-springs-and-weighted-guide-rods.2508/

 

[mattieb]

In my experience (I know I'm new here) the rmr is the way to go for a red dot on a pistol!! I and a few other people I know including Chris costa have had the intensity knob go loose and no longer work correctly. ymmv


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[controlledpairs2]

It's not zero'd, I know I know, but I wanted to see how some different duty loads grouped @ 25yds. In my hands, it liked the Hornady Critical Duty 135 standard pressure the best. 100% function with +p (124 Winchester Ranger T, 115 Gold Dot) and standard pressure duty ammunition (115 and 124 Gold Dot).