Why is nobody using M&P pistols?

Brap&Bang

Amateur
I'm running a M@P 2.0 C for concealed carry. The grip fit my hand better then a gen3 or gen4 glock and I wanted a manual safety for learning appendix carry.

I've got about 3,000 rounds through it without issue.

5 years ago I had a gen 1 M&P 9 and I didn't like it. The 2.0 feels better to me and I'm wondering why nobody here is using/discussing them.

Is there something wrong with the M&P 2.0 pistols?
 
I've been running them for about 7 years. I've got about 5k rounds through my vtac 9mm right now. I used to run glocks also, found the M&P fit my, to quote Pat Rogers "warrior sized" hands. I didn't dislike my glocks, and I shot them well, I just like the M&P better. I'm considering a 2.0 compact to try out for awhile.
 

Brap&Bang

Amateur
I didn't dislike my glocks, and I shot them well, I just like the M&P better. I'm considering a 2.0 compact to try out for awhile.

I have caught the RDS pistol bug and looking at either milling the slide on my M&P 2.0 C or getting a G19 Gen 5 mos ($500 w/ LE discount).
The fact that most of the guys on here who I respect use glocks for their red dot pistols make me think I'm missing something, maybe like Matt said its aftermarket support that makes the difference.
 
I have caught the RDS pistol bug and looking at either milling the slide on my M&P 2.0 C or getting a G19 Gen 5 mos ($500 w/ LE discount).
The fact that most of the guys on here who I respect use glocks for their red dot pistols make me think I'm missing something, maybe like Matt said its aftermarket support that makes the difference.

I've got a M&P core pro with a RDS that I've been playing around with, but I keep getting pulled back to my VTAC.
 

PatMcG

Member
I’ve got a 2.0c milled for rmr. My problem with it is the trigger. It’s still long and shitty to me and the apex trigger shoe is not something I like. The slide to frame fit is retarded sloppy and I can visibly see the slide move sideways when I dry fire. Can watch the dot move an inch at 10yd to the left with the slide movement.


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Brap&Bang

Amateur
I’ve got a 2.0c milled for rmr. My problem with it is the trigger. It’s still long and shitty to me and the apex trigger shoe is not something I like. The slide to frame fit is retarded sloppy and I can visibly see the slide move sideways when I dry fire. Can watch the dot move an inch at 10yd to the left with the slide movement.
I put the Apex "plymer action enhancement trigger & duty/Carry kit for M&P M2.0" in my compact and it made a world of difference. Install was a pain in the ass (unlike installing a glock trigger) and you even have to pound out the rear sight to install the trigger kit.

I can't detect slide movement with my M&P 2.0C when I dry fire.
 

R. Moran

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
I like and shoot M&Ps, have since they first came out.
The first thing I liked about them was the adjustable grip, which was before the Gen4 Glock.
Gen3 Glocks have a too long LOP for me, which requires me to really twist my hand around the grip to get enough finger on the trigger to cleanly release the safety tab. And, it had a thumb safety

I like the hinged trigger, it is less sensitive about finger placement to smoothly release the safety. I have one MP9 with the Apex aluminum glock style trigger and I wish I didn't install it. I'd like to see a factory style trigger in aluminum.
I also like 40 S&W, and the MP40 will function fine with a light attached, something I can't say about G22s I've been issued over the years.

IMO, most of the complaints about the M&P are minor, and easily dealt with....but detractors scream holy hell about them, Glock issues are dismissed though.

Certainly there were enough complaints about accuracy that were mostly contained to the 9mm fullsize, got me....I put a custom twist KKM in mine and it shoots good...didn't shoot bad before though. My 40 have never been an issue...still had match barrels installed. My early 45 was a fucking laser that even Vickers commented on in a class. I shot a custom kinber day one and the stock MP45 day two. It would appear the 2.0 aren't having these issues....and both my glocks have match barrels in them.

Aftermarket...how much do you need?
KKM, BarSto and Apex make barrels, Apex makes trigger components, and everyone makes sights...OK Dawsons topped making his adjustable for it, but their are others. Plenty of shops cut, grind and stipple them. Holsters are available, etc. It's also becomes a vicious self feeding circle. Don't buy an M&P cause theres no aftermarket, theres no aftermarket because people aren't buying M&Ps ....because there is no aftermarket.

Trigger, slide fit, etc....it's a fucking plastic striker fired pistol. People said the same about a glock when compared to even mediocre 1911 and BHP's
Pat Rogers once lamented as to what we have come too, when shooters think a glock is a good trigger. I started on 1911s...and have been contemplating returning to them, and BHPs...of which I'm waiting on one to come back from MARS custom.

A friend bought a 2.0 C when they first came out....I liked it, trigger seemed fine, for what it is. I would carry it, with nothing more then taking a sharpie to the rear sight. I took his 15rd mag and used it to cut down a FS 1.0 I have...we call it the 2.Ghett0 ..semi fit Apex 9-40 barrel and I'm happy with it, carry it regularly.

For the better part of 15 years I carried a G22 on duty, I shot it often and trained up for and competed in the annual agency shooting competition. They're OK, I like them OK enough...I carried an MP40 for a short time at another job, stock gun...I was able to max the fairly easy qual with it, it did go to 25 yards though. My current duty gun is a M9...talk about a long shitty trigger pull. M&Ps are fine.
M&P9mm 110JHP.jpg
 
R. Moran, I've got an earlier M&P 45 with an APEX dcec kit in it, and it ,like yours, shoots lasers as well. Stupidly accurate, far more so than I am capable of.
I also well have a bunch of time behind my 1911's, and in fact shot them exclusively in uspsa for several years along with the associated practice. A striker fired handgun is what it is comparatively, and after its all said and done, I still prefer my M&P 9c over my glock 19. I haven't considered the 2.Ghetto mod, but, i think i'm going to look into it.
 

SCSU74

Member
After witnessing the failures of the gen 1 and their rifle offerings first hand it spoiled me on the company. Only thing S&W I'll own are revolvers. I have 0 trust in anything with M&P on it.
 

shoobe01

Regular Member
...IMO, most of the complaints about the M&P are minor, and easily dealt with....but detractors scream holy hell about them, Glock issues are dismissed though...

This. Totally. Even in this thread.

I have personally seen plenty of Glock failures, all the way to cracked frames and KBs.

The Glock Gen3+WML issues seem much more persistent and troublesome than any of the intermittent issues with M&P v1.

But Glock Perfection® maybe? Not sure why.
 

Maynard

Amateur
Smith autos seem like cheap junk to me, no interest in what appear to be pistols that are on par with Taurus, quality wise.

That may seem pretty harsh but that's how I perceive current Smith and Wesson semi-auto handguns.
 

R. Moran

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
R. Moran, I've got an earlier M&P 45 with an APEX dcec kit in it, and it ,like yours, shoots lasers as well. Stupidly accurate, far more so than I am capable of.
I also well have a bunch of time behind my 1911's, and in fact shot them exclusively in uspsa for several years along with the associated practice. A striker fired handgun is what it is comparatively, and after its all said and done, I still prefer my M&P 9c over my glock 19. I haven't considered the 2.Ghetto mod, but, i think i'm going to look into it.

If you are on LFer, I wrote up the mod over there, with pics

S&W equals Taurus.....OK...
 

Oak City Tactics

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
I’ve had several Issued to me and one had around 8-9k rounds through it. I didn’t mind it. I shot it very well. It was .45 and I didn’t carry it off duty. I had two 9mm 1.0’s. One was Apexed out the other was the optics ready PRO version. I paid $700 for it and within 24 months the 2.0 came out and Smith through their dealers gutted the value of the Pistols by selling the 1.0’s off for practically nothing. I barely got 350 or 400 for the PRO when I tried to get out of it. On top of that, to get into the 2.0 I needed to get new Kydex holsters. The same thing will happen to Agencies that transition. Safariland 1.0 holsters and not to be used with 2.0 pistols according to Safariland. That has not occurred with the Glock platform. Smith will never ever do that to me again. My Glocks are worth the same thing year after year no matter the Generation. My first Gen 2 G23 fits the same support gear as my Gen 4 19’s. If you are going out to buy one pistol the Smith might be ok. If you are living with a system or ever plan on selling it, it might not be a good idea to go down the Smith and Wesson road. That is why I have no love for the M&P.
 

Oak City Tactics

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Oh and I should mention my former agency has stacks of late model M&P 1.0 .45 pistols that don’t work new in the box. Stacks of them. Smiths answer is to buy the 2.0 but something significant happened between the first gun I was issued and the later ones.
 

Wil

Member
We tested a few of the M&P's in .45. My Sheriff's brother is the VP at the largest University in town in charge of safety and security. He has their PD using the 2.0's and they love it. It shot fine when I tested it, but we didn't move to it. I am an avid fan of the Glock pistol, and so is the Sheriff. Mostly we just couldn't find a reason to justify spending the money to switch over.

That said, one of my best non-LE friends runs the 2.0 in 9mm and absolutely loves it over the Glock. Like most things, I think it finally comes down to personal preference.
 

mark1911

<Catchy Title Coming Soon>
Staff member
Moderator
Vendor
I recently went back to the M&P. Milled slide and mounted an RMR on a 2.0. Safariland RMR light bearing holster. Great setup so far.
 

Mr Hardy

Newbie
Frank Proctor seems to like them.

They are reasonably popular up here in New England (probably because they are local), and are growing in popularity with this new 2.0 version among other police departments. My current Team is currently looking for new handguns for 2020 and I have doing a bunch of work on it. I have been in contact with them, and other makers about this as we are looking hopefully for a 9mm with an RDS. Marty Driggs is the LEO rep for Smith and Wesson, and he is a retired Mass Trooper. He has been outstanding to deal with for Law Enforcement, especially with their custom shop. One department I know of with a good budget is having an Apex Flat Faced trigger installed from their custom shop and Smith and Wesson will warranty it. They also told us about a 2.0 CORE in 9mm that we are able to purchase and they will even mill a SIM pistol for an RMR at their custom shop if you request it, which we like, because it would keep our sims consistent with our duty handguns. The departments up here that have them have reported great service, and they offered us a pretty sweet deal on our new pistols if we decide to go with them. The grip on these things is my favorite I have seen on a polymer factory pistol and it is quite aggressive. The trigger is pretty good for a factory striker pistol too. Plus, the steel mags Smith uses drop free easier than the polymer Glock mags and have the same capacity.

I've always been a Glock fan and used to shoot them a lot. Recently when my wife wanted to get into shooting, and she took over my collection of dormant 9mm Glocks (my current duty handgun is an HK, so I stopped shooting Glocks just for consistency's sake) and she struggled with being able to grip it hard enough to allow the gun to cycle properly, especially the gen 4. The Gen 4 would stovepipe regularly, and the gen 3's would sometimes not lock back. It was very frustrating, so much so, that I sent her to take classes with other people because I thought I must be missing something, or just not able to communicate properly when instructing. I personally have never had any issues with Glock when I used to carry them for duty at a previous department I worked for, and when I used to shoot local USPSA matches with them.

After a few months we decided maybe it could be gun fit, so I sent her to a range that allowed rentals and the new M&P 2.0 was just released at the time. She ended up liking the new full size 2.0 version. Where the trigger breaks seems to be further back on it than Glock, which was good for her small hands. She's never had a problem with it cycling, and has since started shooting area USPSA matches with me. We've since bought a Shield, and a compact version and have been really happy with them. We even sent her full size to ATEI and had it milled for an RMR, had front cocking serrations put on, and we had an Apex barrel installed. Now she doesn't want to shoot anything else. She shoots so much more accurately at distance with the RMR.

As far as aftermarket is concerned, all of the gen I holsters I have tried with the 2.0 in 9mm have worked perfectly. I currently have a gen 1 Safariland RDS holster for my 2.0 with an RMR and it works perfect. Same with a Keepers Keeper for off duty. I thought the Gen 5 Glocks had not been the same that way. I thought the new profile on the front of the slide made it so that they were not always compatible with the older generation Glock holsters. I tried it with a gen 5 Glock 17 at a demo last year and it did not fit (non-RDS). This is another thing I wanted to consider with our new department handguns. We want to use the same holster for our duty guns and our sims pistols, and want to have both set up the same.

My wife is trying some of the Taran Tactical +6 base pads, which seem to work fine so far. Apex makes some good triggers and other stuff for them, and I will be interested to try the Overwatch trigger when it becomes available. She opted not to stipple the grip on this one because it is pretty aggressive from the factory, but there are tons of aftermarket options for the M&P. Not as many as Glock, but there are plenty of other pistols out there that I would argue Smith has a better aftermarket for currently, like Walther. One of the projects on my list is to make our compact into a Roland Special type gun since I saw KKM is going to be shipping a threaded barrel for the compact version.

I am really interested in this thread and have been wondering why Primary and Secondary never really talk about the M&P. I'm not as well versed as a lot of guys on this forum and am just a rural patrol cop in an agency of 300 or so, so if anyone has any decent feedback on the M&P 2.0 version then I would also be interested.
 

MrMurphy

Regular Member
Started on k frames and 1911s in the early 90s. Went Glock in 1994ish. Bought my first in 99. Carried one pretty exclusively ever since. Shot an MP40 in the academy (the Smith, not the more fun one...) . Work for an agency which has been Glock since 92.

I like the M&P and would love to try out an APX as we authorize personal guns, but after nearly 2 decades of Glock not a huge reason to change.
 
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