TAP on MBAV, Kangaroo pouch access?

#1
Good morning.

Looking to put a TAP on an MBAV, was wondering to what degree this would block the usage of my kangaroo pouch?

(Intent is high magazine capacity to reproduce LRRP/Resupply unlikely LBE)

This build in theory would enable 11 magazines on my front, and 12th magazine either in pocket, belt if belt works with this platform or already in rifle. (im 5'6 with a long pelvic region and a short torso, so battle belts are often blocked by my torso PPE)

Specifically, would the chest clips block the three magazines i could store in the kangaroo pouch? Could I unclip one of the clips to access the magazines in that location?

If no, il just place pouches on left front of TAP.

(Not looking to debate "magazines on chest being bad in prone" conversation, I have already tested double magazine, vest, plate, soft armor width on my body and it works on me being relatively small)

https://images.app.goo.gl/wRyuFRg3osKN1qfy8

https://images.app.goo.gl/VtAoeozoQHj2spjWA

Kangaroo pouch insert TBD at a later date.

Thanks in advanced for input!
 

Fatboy

Established
#2
In theory it looks like it would work.
Would this be a full time use when armor is worn or just something to plus up when needed?

If full time, I will say that much weight on your front pulling you down will suck after about an hour. It will also hamper your ability to climb in urban environs.

If its to plus up or supplement, rather than add that onto your chest over existing gear, I would look at something like a split front Tactical Tailor MAV and run that adjusted so the sides are offset to my sides, like a hybrid chest rig/ LBE.

So how about more info to your intended load and how you see it being used?
 
#4
Well, outside of ammo, NAR fanny med kit, 3 day or full alice depending on length of shennanigans expected. Water via camel back/MSR bags.

Full time rifleman role, I shoot with individuals who did LRRP in their past life (i was combat support in mine, so I was 6 mags till sept 2014 when I became my own PSD). So ammo is of titanic priority. Hence the 12 magazines.

Range of motion for me, I cant pull mags around my 5,6,7 position.

Previously ran 12 mags on an RBAV and my RRV, so while the weight does suck, my legs, core and back can take take it.

Urban manuverability concerns dont apply in this event, otherwise id go for thigh mounted magazine pouches.

Would put stuff on a belt but not sure if i can manipulate a belt with an MBAV and PPE yet... if i can, a mag or two might get moved to belt and pocket and the kangaroo pouch just goes flat.

If i need to E&E, i can unclip the TAP and stash it in pack.
 

Fatboy

Established
#5
Best suggestion I can give you is if you are dead set on needing all of that ammo is maybe keep a basic load on your vest and put the rest in an assault pack. Or purchase a different cummerbund for the MBAV that has mag pockets on the inside.

As an example, in have a Velocity LEPC with cummerbund. I can fit 3 mags in the kangaroo pouch, with three additional mags on the inside of each c-bund. Add on a single three mag pouch and you have your desired amount of ammo.

Good luck with it.
 
#6
So a spiritus system CBund? (The VS elasticnones on website sere only 2 pockets.

While that is dope, im not sure im ready to drop side armor yet, but it looks like I could shock cord them like the MBAV Cbund and try it like a belly band Cbund.

I was not able to reach my 5,6,7 position on my RBAV, but that vest is bigger in everyway than my MBAV, So this alternative might work.

Previously used the RRV for vehicle operations (barely be functional with all that kit on in vic, so RRV was used like an LBE,) but current training cycle is all foot patrols.

So does any one at this time think the original question is a no go? Il be able to try this come september. Im not.overly concerned if it fails, I still want a TAP for quick 8 mag access, but if it is not functional i have a Weesatch that will basically be the same thing.
 
#8
Okay, saw the clip photo and thought it was just a molle external...

The back part can be solved. (super glue appropriate hook or loop side to internal back panel area)

Do the pockets work to make the hard plate go infront of the soft armor?
 
#10
This is awesome, I cant tell you how many C-bunds do soft armor infront of plate (which violates ICW) or require an external plate bag.

Right now at a course I am at, I am trying to rig a medium IOTV to me as local CIF had no smalls... this c-bund atleast has molle on the inside for pockets and pouches, but no built innolate pocket. Standard soft panel yes.

Yeah, if i can move two magazines to each side and can still reach them, then no nedd for the kangaroo pouch... could even roll a radio of some sort now.
 

Wake27

Regular Member
#11
I have a Velocity Scarab with a similar c-bun. External Molle, hard side plate with retainer strap, soft ICW armor in separate pouch, and then elastic/BFG helium whisper type pouches on the inside. I think three per side. It’s legit, I love Velocity products.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
#12
Yeah The LPAC/LPAAC caught my eye awhile ago, it's my tenative covert carrier in competition with Spiritus systems or the rouge gunfighter rig.

Right now im also looking at tube adapters like First Spear as im in love with corset weave c-bunds.
 

BooneGA

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#17
So a spiritus system CBund? (The VS elasticnones on website sere only 2 pockets.

im not sure im ready to drop side armor yet,
Side plates are 100% incongruent with your stated intention of LRRP/Recce style set up. I would struggle to justify armor at all if that is an accurate picture of your intended role.

I have never used a panel rig that I really liked (and I helped develop the TT rig back in 08/09 before the TAP even came out). I think you are trying to do too much with one set up in this instance. If you are truly doing Recce stuff id stay away from any of the add on panels as weight minimization is going to be key. And, as cool as the Tubes set ups are, they remove MOLLE real estate in critical areas - especially if you are talking about small/medium sized body armor.

Body armor/load out is always going to be a balancing act between protection and lethality. If you attempt to maximize both you end up like Infantry units in AFG back in 2010. Laying down 10 minutes into a gunfight, dry heaving and fighting off heat exhaustion, while your enemy sprints away through the hills in fucking flip flops.

Rick
 
#18
@BooneGA
(On my phone so cant do quotes right just yet)

"So does any one at this time think the original question is a no go? Il be able to try this come september..."

I am willing to drop side plates on the final build, and if time requires it and I need to beat feet, im willing to drop plates as well (a platoon of LAV-25s being on objective beats a company of tanks not on objective as an analogy) but taking a run, walk, crawl on this while being slightly up armored compared to my RRV, which with out a plate would be de-bib'd and be of the actual chest rig philosophy... but that was not the OPI. (Which very well could be too much)

As far as the lost real estate due to tubes, that would not be a concern as the TAP would cover it, and in theory land, if this was not using a TAP, the Raine Tactical Bridger would be employed.

As far as weight goes, the TAP with out harness logically has to be comperable to 6 single mag pouches, a radio pouch and a smoke gernade pouch, and maybe a hair more as it has a back admin area (which restores lost kangaroo flap admin pocket as part of the concern of the OPI)

Right now I am attempting LRRP with more than an RRV with the exact same load.. IF i really wanted to do 12 mags and recon and know it will work, I have that already... this is just to see if added protection could be done.

I know I cant roll full BALCS, ESAPIs and kevlar, RBAV, MAP, 12 mags, FROGS, and water, plus MEE in stated role at 8500 feet, thats been common knowledge just as you said.

I know I can roll a single black SAPI with kevlar(or drop and de-bib), RRV, 2 six mag condor pouches, 2 TAG GP pouches (one IFAK, one admin/spare dump pouch), EI 12 mag dumb pouch, and water...water and more water... this is to see if the MBAV can be a happy medium.

If it does not work this year, il try Matbock or S&S Or JPC 2.0, or WAS LPC... options abound, and who knows what new, lighter gear might be present.

I got the MBAV as half nostalgia buy, half weight reduction from RBAV, its the half way between RBAV and my RRV. I have Weesatch that is purpose built for the Mags, but trying this idea MBAV first. (One project at a time)

Let me know if any of that did not make any sense, text is not the best communication with out apriori knowledge and that is on me for not pre briefing.

Also, side bar, do you still work at TT? I have a MALICE and am really interested in the sleeping system upgrade.
 

BooneGA

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#19
@BooneGA

Also, side bar, do you still work at TT? I have a MALICE and am really interested in the sleeping system upgrade.
I never worked there - was stationed at FT Lewis and had them prototype some things for me that they later marketed.

What is your actual intended use for this set up? I would always recommend against double stacked magazines (especially in shit condor pouches) unless you are going to be exclusively outdoors. And in that case I prefer using a belt style set up - the Tyr harness is my go to for a patrolling rig. A lot of the ideas you are throwing out here were all the rage 10-12 years ago but a lot of thinking has changed since then. I would never wear armor in a true dismounted patrolling situation, but if I did it would 100% be a lightweight plate carrier over anything with full soft armor coverage. In those instances mobility equals lethality and any additional weight becomes more and more of a hindrance with every kilometer you cover on foot.

Rick
 
#20
@BooneGA

About TT: okay, noted.

Intent: Test to see if I can function at 8500 plus feet in a medium armor system (spectrum of BALCS to no armor) under simulated shennanigans in an outdoor setting.

The condor pouches: yes they are crap tastic, but they are functional place holders.

Belts: Unfortunately a lot of belt options dont work as intended (Im short with an odd hip to waist to chest ratio) but the harness systems look possible. (A normal LBV only fits on me wearing a medium IOTV which I drown in)

When i get my next combat pack it will be one of the three mags on top type, which will negate any double stacking in chest, but thats a few purchases down the line.

Future rigs/PC: the Tyr Pico DS assulters, Matbock are on the list, the MBAV will become my under the bed vest. (Unsavory types live near by, I live in a resort condo across from the cheapest long term rentals in the area, and my spouse appoints people to jail)

I entirely agree about weight considerations, 'the soldier's load" was a signifigant intellectual bomb when I was younger.

IF EOTW happened tomorrow id rock the RRV, havent tested the MBAV set up yet, hence why months out im crowd sourcing intellectual apriori.