I’ve read all sorts of reviews on this optic and watched a lot of video reviews. I’d like to hear from users of the Steiner P4Xi about shooting with it at distance. Who here has experience with steel out to 600 with one using the BDC? How did it fare? How close with generic 55 grain with those BDC’s? I’d even be interested how it worked with a 7.62 if you used it on one. For some reason (likely range access). No one reviews how it works beyond 100-200 yards. It’s got holds out to 600 how well have they worked for you?
Steiner P4Xi
- Thread starter Oak City Tactics
- Start date
Joe _K
Established
BDC’s do not work. I’ve never owned a Steiner PX4i, but that rule applies regardless of the optic manufacturer , quality of the glass, or person using it. You’re better off getting a reliable quality ballistic software program, and inputting your DOPE and environmental factors and using holdovers with a Mil reticle.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.
1 Timothy 2:5
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.
1 Timothy 2:5
I am going to strongly disagree here with the absolute writing off of a BDC. BDCs don't work when they aren't matched to the weapon and ammo. If are a military that has one barrel length and one ammo type that will be shot through the gun then you can absolutely use a BDC on your lower powered optics. I personally just have a DOPE card and a mil reticle for all of my rifles that have any kind of magnified optic. However, the vast majority of professional uses where a standardized weapon and standardized ammo is being used, a properly calibrated BDC reticle is easier to train people on and doesn't require people to remember holds.
To answer the original question, definitely use Strelok or a similar program to see how close the holds line up to where you will actually be hitting given MEASURED (do not use what is written on the box, get a chrono) velocities or collected DOPE. Without knowing these two values, or at least a barrel length nobody will be able to tell you how close the BDC will be. A 10.3" 5.56 will have a very different muzzle velocity, and consequently a very different drop and windage chart, than a 16" or 20" rifle of the same caliber and ammo.
Joe _K
Established
Certainly using standardized equipment; Rifles, optic, correct height mount, ammunition lessens the effects of the inherent downsides of a BDC system, but it’s still present. Change any of the following and suddenly your BDC is off, often by a surprising/significant amount. Elevation, temperature, pressure, different ammunition, different height optic mounts than what the BDC was calibrated to at the factory etc.
The Marine Corps Trijicon RCO/SDO, M16A4, M4, M4A1, and M27 are a perfect example of this.
When my Battalion switched to Mk318 ammunition our BDC no longer worked accurately.
We reserved so the 300M mark was POA/POI, flew to a different elevation, BDC was off,
had guys get issued Brit Radway Green Ball, the BDC was off,
had to use M4 marked optics on a 16A4, the BDC was off.
Use an SDO on a 249, BDC was off.
Change in temperature from rainy season in Helmand to the scorching temps in August, BDC was off.
And once it’s off, it’s a guessing game, trying to figure out which hold to use at what distance.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.
1 Timothy 2:5
The Marine Corps Trijicon RCO/SDO, M16A4, M4, M4A1, and M27 are a perfect example of this.
When my Battalion switched to Mk318 ammunition our BDC no longer worked accurately.
We reserved so the 300M mark was POA/POI, flew to a different elevation, BDC was off,
had guys get issued Brit Radway Green Ball, the BDC was off,
had to use M4 marked optics on a 16A4, the BDC was off.
Use an SDO on a 249, BDC was off.
Change in temperature from rainy season in Helmand to the scorching temps in August, BDC was off.
And once it’s off, it’s a guessing game, trying to figure out which hold to use at what distance.
For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus.
1 Timothy 2:5
As to BDC’s the interest is in banging A/C steel not combat anymore. My ACOG TA 01 NSN I’ve had since just after 9/11 has worked well in this application for banging steel and for one Iraq rotation. My kids regularly use the BDC out to 500 with cheap 55 grain. I’ve only found aiming point to matter at the 500 mark. The other marks were more forgiving of where on the target one must hold ie center mass vs chest etc. So in my experience they were pretty usable where I am. May have to work numbers for beyond 500 with the ACOG. I was wondering if I could expect the same performance with the Steiner. If a kid his first time out can be coached into 400-500 yard hits within 5 minutes I call that success. I’ve done that will a few kids in front of fathers that didn’t think 100 was possible for a kid under 10. I just wish folks with the ability and facility to both shoot and do high res video reviews like mrgunsandgear or supersetCA or iraqvet8888 would video this aspect of the product review on this optic.
Without getting too far into the weeds, most of these issues are changing either the gun or ammo the BDC was intended for and two of them are the environmental concerns. However, from sea level to 10,000 ft or from 30 degrees to 110 degrees there is less than a 1.5 MOA ES shift in drop with a 62 gr FMJ. With a 4 MOA gun and 4 MOA ammo the BDC is certainly not completely shutting the system down and unless that shooter is recalculating their MIL chart for change in atmospherics they are going to have the same problem.
I get that they are not the most flexible and they certainly aren't the educated individual professional's system choice but with smart leadership fielding a consistent platform they can absolutely be effective at achieving combat effective hits with less training and less mental effort in real time.
Based Dude
Newbie
I've taken the P4Xi out to 600. Strelok Pro was priceless in learning the nuances of the BDC with different loads. 400 yards and in was cake, 500 and 600 where less consistent due to environmental factors, (wind) my lack of skill, and reticle/magnification limitations.
Longevity wise, mine had about 600-700 rounds threw it before it bit the dust on the M4 zero range, magnification ring locked up and image blurred, I believe that my helmet tapping the rear under recoil, was the cause. It is currently awaiting my return CONUS to be shipped to Steiner for repair
Longevity wise, mine had about 600-700 rounds threw it before it bit the dust on the M4 zero range, magnification ring locked up and image blurred, I believe that my helmet tapping the rear under recoil, was the cause. It is currently awaiting my return CONUS to be shipped to Steiner for repair
The Law Enforcement model comes with the bolt on magnification ring lever. The civilian doesn’t.
P4Xi users- What is your preferred scope mount? How is the one you picked working out?
Thanks for this. That was the kind of Info that’s relatable and valuable. This is the second report I’ve read of internal components failing in a similar way. It’s concerning. I’ve read speculations that this is the manufacture step where Steiner saved the money but no engineering analysis to back that up. I’ve certainly had nothing but Awesome customer service from Steiner over at least 25 years of service. I qualified for free binoculars when they ran the program for soldiers deployed to get the binos that they repaired after sending the original owners new ones. When the were set to deliver them I had already rotated home but they let me redirect mine to a coworker who was deployed on another rotation to Afghanistan. They replaced the rubber skins on several pairs for both me and my dad over that time and provided countless eye cups after we lost them. The only costs I’ve ever incurred were the initial purchase prices.
ADM Recon. Low round count as of now but I can tell you that the return to zero is no joke. Took the mount off to zero irons. When I put I back on and checked zero I put 5 rounds through the same hole dead center point of aim.
Grayman
Established
I have run my P4Xi out to 400 and used the iStrelok app with great success. It even shows you what your stadia BDC lines equate to for your exact setup. Well worth the money!
I am running mine in a Geissle 2.04" mount. I found this height to be extremely conducive for a wide variety of different shooting positions. I was able to run it with great success through VCQBi which is a real test of optic versatility
I am running mine in a Geissle 2.04" mount. I found this height to be extremely conducive for a wide variety of different shooting positions. I was able to run it with great success through VCQBi which is a real test of optic versatility
Based Dude
Newbie
ADM recon standard height,as it was available from the same vendor I purchased the scope from. I've had excellent return to zero with it.
Thanks for the feedback. One of these is on my short list this year.
tmoore
Member
got my p4xi in two weeks ago or so, using the ADM 30mm qd mount ( recon). this is my first delve into the LPVO world and i dont know what took me so long to jump on this train. I will most likely never buy a red dot again and just go LPVO instead. putting myself on a shot timer I am no slower with my Steiner than I am with my MROs plus I now have the ability to zoom if i feel the need to. as far as the ADM mount goes it works just fine as any quality scope mount does. I dont have an extensive amount of experience with powered optics and mounts, living in NH things get pretty tight in the woods around here so iv personally never felt the need for much magnification beyond 4x. Making hits at 300 yards has never been a problem with irons or red dots but the ability to zoom and more clearly discern my targets is absolutely invaluable!
I don’t remember what they’re listed for now, but Vortex recently dropped the price on them so they’re pretty competitive to the Steiner now, even with regular pricing.
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