Slick fronts?

[Erick Gelhaus]

There was discussion somewhere recently on having a slick front on one's external armor carrier to facilitate climbing walls, etc. Because of work most on my equipment is on the duty belt, while AR mags, IFAK and TQs are on the plate carrier.

If it violate any issues, can some of you who go with a slick front? Thanks.

 

[Bourneshooter]

For a rural loadout on LE operations, I run the "slick" front of a Crye JPC. I use the internal Kangaroo pouch of the JPC for my M4 mags so its pretty slick. I've started to use this same PC for my on duty active shooter/man with a gun response rig as well. It seems to be perfect for what I need in regards to slim enough to wear while driving, as well as the climbing factor although I havent had to do that since switching to a JPC.

 

[Bronson]

My .mil combat load is 3-5 magazines for the M4 FOW on a split front sniper harness. "Aim More, Shoot Less." For specific missions (long duration, Indian Country) - I will plus up magazines and those will be on the front. I have a integral kangaroo pouch on the Tyr LWPC that they go in with a BFG Ten Speed Triple M4 attached to the front of that - which is typically slick or housing boom boom or medical. I have a D27 TQ/Admin Pouch centerline high on the chest and a pouch on either side of it housing a handheld flashlight and multitool. They aren't protrusive.

A slick front works especially well for two things -

1) Getting into the prone.

Folks in the prone with a lot of front-mounted kit will be a larger target indicator to the enemy because the chest kit will push you further up from the earth. You also have to assume a more awkward shooting position which is not sustainable for prolonged periods of time - especially when you factor a helmet into the equation. It is reducing both lethality and survivability.

2) Climbing over walls / obstacles / terrain features

Combat agility is needed. Dudes with a double stack of front-mounted magazines or M249 nutsacks on their chest have a more difficult time in scaling over these things - fact. It's simple physics and physiology - you are expending more energy (effort) by being further away from the obstacle(s) using various muscle groups to traverse it. It's not only more physically taxing, it's more difficult and time-consuming to accomplish.

We need to get to the fight, fight, then move off to the next fight and keep giving bad guys the good news.

 

[Dan_Kemp]

Vehicle operations can be a consideration in running slick, and how well you in issued gear FIT in the vehicle.

In 2005, we finally decided the 2nd Brigade SOP would be all pouches would be directly attached to the IBA. Me, I made a deliberate decision with my 1SG's support to run a SOE Hellcat chest rig and leave my IBA slick. I was the 1SG's driver, among other things. I am a 2XL sized human being. The combined thickness of a rear ESAPI, Kevlar, me, more Kevlar, and a front ESAPI basically consumed all available space between the seat back of a M1114 or M1151 and the steering wheel. Ammo pouches just were NOT happening. I threw my chest rig over by the gear shift lever and figured I would grab it in event of bailout. When I traded jobs with the gunner, I did wear my chest rig in the hatch, just because I figured I would pop the Fastex buckles on the shoulder straps if I needed to get out of the rig in event I was hung up. Also had my strap cutter and a couple other knives around in event I was hung up.

 

[MattJames]

Slick front, or at the minimum only one magazine deep in a low profile pouch (BFG Tenspeed is perfect). Pouch's are ran on the carrier. For MOST chest rigs on the market, the added weight of the rig itself as well as the added bulk is frankly not worth it IMHO. Now there are exceptions in some products, or rigs that are made to snap in and give that upscale/downscale capability. But those are not the norm in this industry, however your seeing a lot more these days, which is a good thing as I think it gives you the most flexibility coupled with a molle belt setup.

Climbing is a big deal a lot of people who have gotten comfy with the idea of fighting around/with vehicles. I saw a lot of this attitude, as well as the attitude of carrying what amounts to 1.5+ combat loads despite fighting out of vehicles.... KISS along the lines of your mission, and if it is collecting dust, it likely can get dumped and stay in the rear.

 

[Dan_Kemp]

Matt, my thought was if I was getting out of the vehicle (the driver always stays with), it was because it got blown up. Assuming I wasn't badly wounded or dead as a result, we then would have wounded at the same time we lost the crew-served on the roof (usually an M2HB on my truck). I figured at that point the 1.5 fighting loads (plus the extra oh shit boxes in the back) would pay off. I didn't think we'd necessarily recover all of it, but given the AO we might need all we could get out of the wreck. Then again I will confess to a certain paranoia.

Still, mounted operations near Mahmudiyah along MSR Tampa are a historical curiosity except for the lesson "Make sure you can fit in the truck with all your shit on" that I mentioned.

 

[MattJames]

I know, I had the same rig setup with an IBA, but what I found at least with the IOTV is that it was already bulky enough as it is, that a chest rig made it soooo much worse that I ditched it and just went straight up attached to carrier. I wish I could have ran a PC like the APC, as it would have made rigging up two different load outs for running the M4 and M110/M4 ammo combo's a lot more elegant and simplified. Also a lot less headache when swapping weapon systems.

Ironically enough I ran the same rig in the SAME place on my first tour... good ol MMD and Tampa. I didn't run a 7.62 rifle at that time either. But I knew a lot less then and just running my own rig was a leap ahead from what i had issued. Go bags distributed between all the trucks for each fighting element as well as some extra's are a good way to provide overlap (like the speedball concept Bronson has proposed in the past) in case said vic goes hard down due to IED/RPG/Wreck. I was also climbing... alot during Tour #2 and anything past 1 mag wide on the front would have made that infinitely more difficult.

The problem with paranoia is that it leads to overloading... which arguably is just as detrimental to overall performance as anything.