RDS on pistols

Matt

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
I have a RM06 getting mounted on a pistol right now. I have yet to shoot with an RDS on any pistol, but I chose the RM06 because of manually adjustable brightness, manual on/off, and the ability to enable/disable automatic brightness adjust. 3.25 MOA dot sounded like the right size since I have been shooting with a 4 MOA T-1 on my AR for a couple years and it seems to work well inside of 300m. My reasons for choosing the RM06 were based on research and anecdotal info, so I look forward to hearing more from those who have been using pistol-mounted RDS for a while.
 
When I was shooting Steel Challenge and USPSA I had a few pistols with dot sights on them and there was no doubt I was faster and more accurate with them. Now on a self defense pistol it never crossed my mind. They were to big , to heavy, could not leave it on all the time, etc. ..... But with the new micro dots and and mounting solutions it is something to look at. When I shot one the first time I was like "it's not for me" but I could see it being useful. The second time I shot one it was a little better and I though "maybe". Now it's on my list of wants. Not very high but if I come across a good deal and have the extra funds its on!
 

Pat Tarrant

Custom testicles
Staff member
Moderator
I have an RMR06 on a full size M&P9. I'm considering getting a similar setup on my M&P9 compact. However, I'm also liking that T-1 type sealed RDS are being successfully mounted to handguns, and look forward to seeing where that goes. The upcoming release of the ALG six second mount looks like a really good option for a bedside gun or for those where openly carrying doesn't raise attention. However, it may or may not be that great to conceal. Despite the drawbacks of RMR type optics where debris or water can interfere with the sight, it provides a fairly dependable and easily concealable sight that greatly expands the practical engagement distance and makes precise shots easier for those with less time to commit.

As far as RDS on handguns in general, if it feels like you're cheating, you're doing it right. As long as it works when you need it to, and doesn't interfere with function if it fails.
 

LSP972

Newbie
A pair of Bowie Signature G19s with the now-out-of-print Trijicon clone of the JPoint. Most excellent concealed-carry pieces; about as trim and low-profile as you're gonna get. I've had them going on five years now, been playing with them on and off, as I am just not ready yet to go all-in with the concept.

A few years ago, on a whim I bought one of Suarez's G19 slides cut for an RMR to go on my first Bowie G19 Signature with a "normal" slide. Sometimes I wonder what color the trees are in that guy's (Suarez) world... but his claim that their OST slides are better-quality than OEM is actually true. I bought another one, for normal sights, just last year. They are made from stainless and are simply superb. Crisper machining and finish, just excellent product.

Anyway, I put an RMR02 and supressor-height trits on the first one. It doesn't conceal as well as the JPoint clone-equipped versions, because the RMR sits more forward on the slide (interfering with holster fit) and the RMR is just bigger all around. Great shooter though. I had to acquire a holster that would fit the RMR; a Dale Fricke OWB that is a bit bulky, but an excellent choice when I'm not concerned with concealment.

I chose Bowie's work because his slide contouring and grip reduction/stippling makes a whole new gun out of your basic Glock 19. A Glock of any stripe will never be more than a disposable bullet launcher to me, but they are- usually- damned efficient disposable bullet launchers, and the Bowie grip reduction makes them a much better shooter; the only person I've let shoot them who wasn't overwhelmed by the improved feel was an old comrade with very large hands. And the Glock "platform' is, hands-down, the best one for mounting an optic... due mainly to rthe flat top slide and the location of the FPB up near the breech face. Many other pistols (notably Sig and HK) have slide designs that complicate the inletting required to get an optic properly low-mounted. It can be done, but the resulting package simply cannot compare to the compactness of a Glock package. If you're concealing the pistol, this matters.

In any event, with my vision steadily failing as I age, the RDS pistol is THE answer to "old man eyes" and the resultant inability to get a decent sight picture... so I'm going to have to go "all-in" with the concept at some point. While there are more choices- as in, more people doing these conversions right- now than when I embarked on the journey, one still should be VERY careful about who he chooses to do it.

And be prepared to change your preferred carry holster. I had to modify my chosen kydex IWB a bit to accomodate the optic; fortunately, my holster maker is here in town, right on my way home from work.

As for the drawbacks, my main concern is the durability of the optic. But that's why you have the back-up irons. I have worked with my three examples enough to know that the concept is valid, and carried IWB you won't have the condensation issue in cold weather, because your body heat keeps the lens warm enough to prevent fogging.

Newcomers to the game just need to understand that there is a definite, and somewhat steep, learning curve associated with these things. But someone with the resources and patience to work through the learning process will soon realize that it really IS a better mouse trap.

.
 

JPourciau

Newbie
My EDC is a G19 with an RM07. If I were to do it again, I might go with the RM02 instead. My original slide was milled by SI, and I was quite pleased with the fit and finish. My RM07 is now mounted on a SI slide on my G19. I agree with the above poster that the SI slide is top notch, and I think that SI has the RDS Glock figured out. I have a Dale Fricke AIWB holster for concealment purposes and a Blade-Tech WRS Level II for rifle classes and such. One thing I have noticed is that my friend who has 68 year old eyes loves the thing! I don't feel disadvantaged when I occasionally carry my iron sighted G26, but the RMR definitely seems to be advantageous for longer shots and precision work. Later this month, I will have an opportunity to run it at a higher round count class and really get a feel for it. One note on the adjustable model RMRs... Of all the dot failures I have heard of, changing the battery seems to correct most if not all of them. Don't know why, but I experienced the phenomenon myself with a brand new RMR. Changing the battery solved the issue and it has been fine since. I have direct knowledge of at least one other person with the same issue and resolution, and anecdotal knowledge of several others. Makes me wonder about Trijicon's OEM battery vendor.
 

Default.mp3

Established
I went with the Trijicon RMR RM06 after waiting for about a year to get more information about the Leupold Deltapoint Pro. After information trickled out, I spoke a little with Trent Zimmer over at Unity Tactical, and he suggested that I just go ahead and go with the RMR over the Deltapoint Pro, as there was still a significantly lead time before general release of the Deltapoint Pro, along with the fact that it is a taller optic than the RMR, and would require even taller BUIS than the RMR. The original hope had been that I'd be able to mount the Deltapoint Pro like the Deltapoint, in that it wouldn't need a separate adapter plate for the P30LS, but that didn't work out as I had hoped. I had Mark Housel over at L&M Precision do the work for me; he'll be getting a second P30LS from me soon enough, too.

I've not found myself slowed any compared to my irons (Hienies with the front sight painted bright orange) while running my standard practice drill (3×5 index cards at 7 yards); the caveat to that is that I've never been a very fast shooter (~2.2 seconds from the appendix concealed, ~.45 second splits, ~2.4 second reloads). I have found myself more consistent, though; with irons, when pushing myself, I had a habit of dropping shots just half an inch low (which was pretty infuriating). I've also found the laser dot to be less distracting with the RMR compared to the irons. The main area I've found myself much slower in acquiring a sight picture is when starting from a position I don't have a well developed index for, e.g., drawing SHO or WHO. However, I've found that the feedback given by the RMR means I'm breaking the shot much faster than with irons, after I've acquired the sight picture, so speed is a wash, while there is a definite accuracy edge with the RMR.

I purposely chose an adjustable RMR because of concerns of dot washout from my WML; this proved to be a valid issue, as the RM06 run in auto mode does wash out quite easily indoors when used in conjunction with the X400U. I currently keep it at the 11th brightness setting (out of 12); I was keeping it at 10 originally, as it was perfect for indoor, but it proved to be too dim outdoors in direct sunlight, where 12 was best, but had massive bloom outside of anything in direct sunlight. Beyond that, the only hardware issue I've had is that the RMR had on two separate occasion somehow gotten back to auto mode.

And yes, this is what I carry for EDC (including the watch, though normally in a more conventional spot).
 

Matt

Moderator
Staff member
Moderator
Does anyone have experience with RMRs in rain or water? That little o-ring around the bottom is supposed to keep it waterproof to 10 meters? That is what the included owner's manual says, but I am not buying it.

And, JP, my late 2014 production RM06 had an Energizer battery included, FWIW.
 

MattJames

Certified Derpologist
Staff member
Moderator
Anyone have the Delta-Point Pro mounted on anything yet? I'd be very curious to see it durability tested along side the RMR-06, which seems to be the crowd favourite for slide mounted RDS's. I have *very* little time on a pistol RDS. So much so that I hesitate to comment. I intend to fix that when I get back.
 

hogarth

Member
I'd seen a few RMR-equipped handguns (Glocks, mostly) in some classes, and then got the opportunity to try out a fellow student's in Steve Fisher's Critical Handgun Employment 2 class (Sentinel Concepts) in April of 2014. It was a Glock 19 with RM06. I put 20-30 rounds through it at 25 ft and 25 yards and was quite impressed.

JPourciau (a few posts above) was switching to a Suarez slide, so I bought his factory slide that had been milled by Suarez from him for a good price, added an RM07, and have been happy. I haven't fully mastered it yet, but I like it. It helps a lot with dryfire, shooting quickly at closer ranges, and also shooting for more precision at longer ranges. I got the 07 vs the 06 because that's what various people recommended to me. In hindsight, I do wonder if I should have gone 06, as the smaller dot would allow for more precision at the longer ranges, assuming I did my part.
 

ptrlcop

Established
I use a G17 equipped with an RMR 01 for my duty gun. I really dig it and it makes it pretty hard to miss when I don't dick the dog. The other day my buddy and I were comparing mine vs his 6.5 moa adjustable(07?). His dot actually looked crisper to my eye even though it is theoretically bigger. At that point however I think we are worrying about minutiae. The dot will wash out at close range when used in combo with an X300U, but I don't worry about it because at those ranges(inside 5yds) I don't really need the dot and have simply used my front site.
 

thomaspara1

Newbie
I have a Gen 3, G19 milled by L&M Precision, with a Trijicon RMR02 installed on it, and suppressor height sights. Initially it took me a solid month of dry-fire and manipulation, coupled with range time in order to get comfortable to carry this as a Duty carry, and EDC. I have read many different opinions about which dot size is more preferable, and to me, each opinion is valid based on each individuals use. I personally like the 6.5 MOA dot, and for me it offers quicker acquisition of the dot. I also notice that this dot size for me does not present any problems when used with a Surefire X300. I have also been fortunate to not have experienced any of the problems that some were seeing with dimming dot, or blinking dot. I have been using this setup since 2012, and have not babied it at all, also it has not yet required a battery change. So far, this has been a great addition and I am very pleased with it.

G19RMR.jpg
 
20141209_132435_zpsb40446fe.jpeg

G19 w/ Trij RMR02. Only RDS I've ever used on a pistol. I was told they are no longer being manufactured but they are one of the better RDS's you can get for pistol work. L&M did the work to the slide and installed the RMR. Trijicon all black suppressor height sights with a dollup of subdued red nail polish on the front sight. No experience but I've hear with night sights you tend to get too much stuff going on for your eyes when your trying to get a sight picture. Like stated above, the learning curve was a bit of a handful but once you get it down RDS's are the way to go, especially if you run a suppressor. Only con thus far is there are times the dot will wash out with the X300U but they are few and far between, usually when I'm a few inches from a white wall and the white plume in the middle of the light reflects horribly back into my eyes.
 

MattJames

Certified Derpologist
Staff member
Moderator
Roland- Yup, hence why I'm very interested in getting my G19 w/ RMR06 up and running when I get back. Also... finding a new application for an extra T1. First World Problems.

Per your earlier reply, thats exactly why my G34 will be pretty much just a Production pistol for me. Minimal effort, minimal mods, and a platform I have put the most bullets through out of any pistol. But once I become comfy with it, I will likely carry my G19 RMR06. I imagine the faster slide movement of the smaller pistols is actually a benefit to the RDS pistols in so far as picking up the dot faster. That and not being a limp wrist.
 
Last edited:

AndersonAUB

Newbie
I have a few friends who run variations of every gun talked about on this thread.

I will say that they are all carrying these as operational Duty guns. They are all much faster, more accurate and more confident in their shot placement.

I would like to get my hands on a factory glock 34 that is set up for an RMR from the factory.
 
Top