Discussion - How beneficial is a .22LR duplicate pistol for training?

[rudukai13]

Well gentlemen, time for another question to hopefully spark some lively conversation. Inspired by Glock’s announcement of the G44 (G19-sized .22LR platform), this thought crossed my mind recently.

Way back when my dad was first teaching me how to shoot, the only handguns he owned were a few S&W revolvers in 357/38 and 44 calibers, but he also had a revolver that was dimensionally identical to one of the 357/38 wheelguns chambered in .22LR. He explained to me that not only was the .22LR revolver easier for new shooters (like myself at the time) to handle, but that they were also helpful training aids for shooters of all experience levels and could be used as an intermediate step between dryfire practice and the larger caliber guns - allowing a shooter to focus on fundamentals like sight alignment, grip, and trigger press, without worrying about flinch-inducing recoil, while still providing more significant feedback than dryfire in the form of visible groups on target. Plus, the ammo was much less expensive than the real defensive calibers to practice with.

Much later on in my life and shooting career I would go on to sell him the very first handgun I ever bought for myself, a Sig 1911 in .45 (I know, I was still relatively inexperienced at that time of purchase and didn’t know any better - forgive me!), which became the first semi-auto handgun he’d ever personally owned. One of the first accessories he purchased for the gun was a .22LR conversion slide assembly, noting the same points he’d expressed many years before.

That said, I haven’t seen much discussion here about whether or not having a .22LR variant of your primary duty/EDC pistol for practice is in fact beneficial, and if so to what extent. So that’s the question I’d like to pose - Do you agree with my dad’s teachings? Do you own a .22LR variant of your primary duty/EDC pistol? If so, how much do you shoot it? For those of you who currently primarily shoot and carry Glocks, do you plan to purchase a G44 for this purpose?

For the purposes of this thread, let’s keep the focus of discussion on .22LR as a training implement. There are obvious advantages to starting new shooters out on the light recoiling round, as well as the fun factor of having a cheap plinking pistol for the ubiquitous cartridge

 

[user12358]

Above all else .22lr is much cheaper than centerfire calibers. I have 15.5k rounds on a P226 .22lr and around 6k on a Volquartsen Scorpion which is slightly outside the scope of your original question but still useful.

I got the P226 back when I was using a classic P-Series for everything and didn't have anywhere near the ammo availability I have now. With the .22lr I was able to shoot 150 rounds a day for 5 days a week on my own time and dime. This led to me having very good trigger control and sight alignment, it also completely failed to expose weaknesses and inefficiencies in my grip that NATO 9x19 was more than happy to illuminate. I also developed a habit of riding the slide release which I had no idea about because of the lack of a lock back capability with the pistol. I would later use this pistol to rehab my hand from an injury but quickly progressed back to centerfire exclusively.

The Scorpion resembles absolutely nothing that I would use for serious use and was only purchased on the quest for a 100-10x. It gets shot occasionally and I still have yet to get to the 100-10x (7x is my current ceiling and it has not been a great priority to push it much further.) It was however a fantastic training tool for teaching visual patience while removing the gun from the equation as much as possible from an accuracy standpoint.

I currently use Glocks for everything and have absolutely no intention of getting a G44 because .22lr trainers don't play well with the added mass of slide mounted optics for the most part and that is all that I have shot for years now coupled with the fact that I don't really have an ammo limitation. If someone was going to get a .22lr for training I would recommend they end their training session with a box of 9 through their primary pistol to prove out what they have been working on and make sure that no gremlins are developing with the .22lr pistol.

22lr AR uppers are even more effective in my opinion but that is outside the scope of this thread.

 

[oda175]

.22 LR is a phenomenal training implement, and am pretty happy about the G44 release.

While I was on the Army Rifle team- we spent a ton of time in the off season on the Olympic team’s indoor range. We had .22 uppers we put in our comp lowers and go to work. we could fire entire 500/800 matches indoors.

I have always kicked around the idea of grabbing a .22 upper for my 19s. Just wasnt available for the Gen 5 - and many had poor reviews. And honestly when I looked at the cost- I just bought more 9mm in its place.

Plan is to snag of of these and immediately mill it for a RM06- well play with spring weight if we have cycling issues. I have a steel trap target that I shoot inside my barn with .22 and pellets. Quick and easy, and better feedback than dryfires alone.

 

[rudukai13]

Plan is to snag of of these and immediately mill it for a RM06- well play with spring weight if we have cycling issues. I have a steel trap target that I shoot inside my barn with .22 and pellets. Quick and easy, and better feedback than dryfires alone.

You may have difficulty mounting a RMR to the G44, the slide is mostly polymer. I imagine in about six months though they’ll release a MOS optics-ready version considering the popularity of the MOS G19 model

 

[Gypsy EDC]

Dryfire, sirt, Airsoft, & 22lr all provide training opportunities if you treat them as training opportunities.

I have 2 g17 22lr uppers and especially like them for familiarizing the kids to Glock ergonomics.

 

[Gypsy EDC]

You may have difficulty mounting a RMR to the G44, the slide is mostly polymer. I imagine in about six months though they’ll release a MOS optics-ready version considering the popularity of the MOS G19 model

Best guess is the reason they didn't, is that the additional mass of a mounted optic compromised function. But it also wouldn't be the first time Glock slow played the market.

 

[oda175]

Yeah- figured it would be a polymer. Will run same as I do my FX17. Should still work- imperfect- no irons unless using a Dueck RBS- but for its purpose will work.

 

[Clay1]

When ammo prices were crazy a few years ago, I bought a CMMG conversion kit for my AR and an adapter so that I could use S&W 22 mags that actually locked the slide back so that you could really practice real mag changes on the AR.

I also bought a G34 lower and then put an Advantage Arms conversion kit on the top of that. Paid for both of the kits in short order when ammo costs were crazy.

With the G34 lower it was the same as my competition gun, not kind of like it. It has the minus connector in it and the trigger surface was the exact same as the comp gun.

I still use it as a training aid for students, but with ammo costs lower, I prefer using full power loads so that my timing with duty ammo isn't so off, I keep a better edge on my grip with full power loads too and my recoil control stays stronger with regular 9mm ammo vs rimfire. As a matter of fact, I just bought 2000 rounds of Winchester 9mm NATO to fire through the G19 with Comp and X300U. Wanted the higher pressure to take advantage of the Compensator and emulate my duty rounds better.

So for me TODAY. I went the complete opposite of rimfire for training. Went from 9mm Blazer, WWB, Federal etc to a NATO loading.

Bottom line, is time with the gun in your hand practicing the right things is all good. Just don't get wimpy with your grip shooting too much rimfire, Don't relax too much with your form with the itty bitty recoil. Maybe mix in some rimfire to save a penny, but still shoot the real deal. Also buy a few hundred NATO rounds reasonably to get a sense of what you will face while shooting duty rounds.

Go Shoot, Be Happy.