Change is hard, AIWB with comped G19 help?

#1
I'm an old guy, I still shoot thousands of rounds per year. Most of my last 10 years I pull the trigger on a G34 out of a USPSA production style holster. Out of that holster, under a vest, I can break the 1 second mark easily with that concealment method. If I have a good day, I can get in the .8s somewhere, if I have an exceptional day, I have hit the upper .7s.

I decide that I want a dot, and not just the change to the dot, but the change to AIWB with a G19.5, compensated with a X300U light. No magwell on the gen 5. Trying to conceal under a hoodie instead of the vest. No, not a Timmie vest, but like a Carhartt. My draws tonight were abysmal. Best I could do was about a second and a quarter at 7 yards.

I thought AWIB was suppose to be faster, not slower. I know it's the Indian and not the method. Thinking back on tonight's range session, I think that I am clearing the kind of long hoodie all the way to my chest before I even start for the gun. My grip is much different since the gun is tighter to my body on the draw. Trying to put the thumb on the top, left hand corner of the rear iron sights as per a video I saw from Modern Samurai Project.

When working on reloads, I focus on getting the new mag with my support hand more than dropping the mag in the gun and that helped reloads a bunch. What kinds of things should I be focusing on to improve my draw stroke from AIWB?

What were some of your "Ah Ha moments when it came to cutting time from AIWB? If you choose the best type of hoodie of sweat shirt to work from, what features do you look for in a cover garment for AIWB? A couple of times, I not only grabbed the hoodie, but the shirt underneath of it. What would be your best combo of shirt next to the body, between the gun and you and cover hoodie?

Sorry so many questions. Thanks for a gentle nudge in the right direction.

Note: hoslter is Tenicor Malus Sol for this rig.
 
#2
As I’m sure you know from years of experience getting that sub 1 second draw down, practice is key. I know you mentioned the modern samuri project video, he’s got about 4 or 5 videos available on his YouTube page going over every part of the appendix draw. He’s one of the best to clearly teach the basic principles of the draw, those videos helped me a lot. If you have a smart phone that’s capable of slow motion videos, set it up in front of you and get a couple draws in. Watch them back, compare to jedlinski’s videos and see what could be improved. The video of yourself will show you some flaws you might not be feeling. Is your draw time to first fire slower because of your draw mechanics, or from finding the red dot and getting a good shot off?


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#3
When I appendix carry with a hoodie, I typically wear a tight undershirt, like a wife beater, underneath my gun to keep it off my skin. Then my T-shirt and hoodie are both overtop the gun. So I’m grabbing both the T-shirt and the hoodie at the same time. Not saying that’s the best way, just the way I’ve always done it.


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#4
Clay. If your rocking .7s from under a vest I’m going to say you’ll have no problem with the more efficient draw from appendix. To be honest I’m not sure how you haven’t made an easy time of it.

In fact you’re whole change seems odd to me. Why?
 
#6
I do think that it is the 4 changes all at once: New gun, new sighting system, new carry method and new cover garment.

I think that I am waiting for too much information from the dot. I am reconfirming it's position before the shot takes place. I love a drill that I haven't run recently, in which you do a 5 second draw and break down the whole cycle (without stopping at any spot just doing a smooth draw) then go to a 4 second, 3 second, 2 second, 1 second and then shove it. I think that I first saw that from Travis Hailey, but don't know who introduced that process. Go slow so that you can go faster.

I also don't want to give you the impression that I do a draw in the .7s cold. Many times my draws from my production holster can be 1.25, but let me just work on draws and do 20 draws and hit sub one second is never a problem, .9 are common, .8 can be done and for me when I have one of those special days ( just a few times per year, when the sun and moon all line up ) something in the .7s occur. I don't want to overstate my ability. The other thing that I am thinking is when I do these, (just for speed draws), I typically do those at 3 yards not 7.

I will figure it out, but it's not easy and I was mostly just venting frustration last night. Thanks for the thoughts everyone.

Note: I have a MSP class all paid for, but that's not until June. First league night tomorrow night as well. I'll shoot it from concealment to keep working on the skill set. Thanks for the encouragement everyone. I also have a GoPro, I'll have to break that thing out.
 

Oak City Tactics

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#8
I find that an under shirt is better tucked in and secured. That being said a t shirt can easily cover it. It will always be simpler to have only one cover garment such as a button up, hoodie, or t shirt. I have the best success grabbing the bottom edge of the cover garment and not the material at the center of the chest, that only seems to work well for T-shirt’s or polos in summer with no other layers.

As for the mechanics if your phone is capable video yourself in slow motion several times. Repeat until you capture several fails. Watch and analyze what you are seeing. Adjust accordingly until the most efficient and reliable technique is determined.
 
#9
When I appendix carry with a hoodie, I typically wear a tight undershirt, like a wife beater, underneath my gun to keep it off my skin. Then my T-shirt and hoodie are both overtop the gun. So I’m grabbing both the T-shirt and the hoodie at the same time. Not saying that’s the best way, just the way I’ve always done it.


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I've had good luck using compression-fit Under Armour shirts as undershirts when carrying. They hold tight to the torso reducing your odds of grabbing the undershirt and have generous length reducing the odds of coming untucked.
 
#10
Why? they are pretty separate from each other. They aren't compounding any difficulty. Draw when you need to draw, aim with the rds when you need to aim - they don't intersect.
The Why is simply because the OP might benefit from it. Deliberate Practice, Steve Andersen Shooting and all that. If he was happy with his 1.25 second draw then he would have no need to try something else. I feel like in order to approach a .7 draw from AIWB he's going to have to isolate and correct every little inefficiency, including mastering the RDS index/sight picture.

I think that I am waiting for too much information from the dot. I am reconfirming it's position before the shot takes place.
I did the same thing when first I adopted RDS. This type of error is worth a few .10s. The short answer is shoot an acceptable sight picture dictated by the target. Big close targets don't get a dot. They get a streak etc. Jedi covers this issue well in his RDS class. He's a great instructor.
 
#11
Thanks everyone. I shot a local pistol match tonight with the comped 19.5 with the dot and a X300u from concealment under a sweat shirt. Between me and the gun a relatively tight T. I shot in open class from concealment. The draws weren't blazing fast, I just wanted to hit what I was aiming at. Finding the dot is getting more consistent and I didn't grab my tighter T with the sweatshirt. I can see how NOTHING between the gun and me will be the most consistent. Maybe not the most comfortable, but the most consistent.
 
#12
Tried to edit the above but was over the par time of 5 minutes so thought that I would post this:

Thanks everyone. I shot a local pistol match last night with the comped 19.5 with the RM06 and a X300u from concealment under a sweat shirt. Between me and the gun was a relatively tight T. I shot in open class from concealment. The draws weren't blazing fast, I just wanted to hit what I was aiming at. Finding the dot is getting more consistent and I didn't grab my tighter T with the sweatshirt. I can see how NOTHING between the gun and me will be the most consistent. Maybe not the most comfortable, but the most consistent.

I did buy some even tighter T's today to make sure that I don't grab the T and the sweat shirt at the same time. I now have some T shirts to carry with and some T shirts to wear under the cover garment between my body and the gun (two different sizes Large/ Extra Large and some Mediums). Never thought that my wardrobe would be so gun carry style dependent.

The biggest take away from a guy that runs a whole bunch of drills but hasn't competed lately is that the "game is less about hitting a target or two and more about stage planning and movement. Not sure that I really like that skill set shift from actual street use. There is no scenario that I can think of that once the fight begins that I expend close to 40 rounds.

Bottom line, I'm getting reps with my carry gun, with my carry style (AIWB) out of my normal drill training routine, so life is good.